Culture Clash

[Diva]

"The Air Force's highest-ranking female (http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20011203/us/military_muslim_garb_2.html) fighter pilot sued on Monday to try to overturn a policy requiring servicewomen to wear restrictive Muslim clothing when off base in Saudi Arabia.

Female military personnel in Saudi Arabia must wear black head-to-foot robes called abayas and ride in the back seat when off base. They can only leave base if they are accompanied by a man.

Lt. Col. Martha McSally says the policy is unconstitutional. It discriminates against women and violates their religious freedom, forcing them to wear clothing and follow customs mandated by a religion other than their own, her lawsuit says."

Do you agree or disagree? Let the brawl begin...

http://www.nochicktrix.com/fun/xnews/mcsally.jpg

[Anton]

Its part of her job. She should be allowed to wear what she wants but she is stationed in a country that does not agree. I assume her job is to keep the peace, there probably won't be much peace if she strolls around dress like she normally would.

Chances are she'd be arrested and stoned to deat before you can say khomeni

[Amaurote]

I have no doubts whatsoever that her legal action will succeed. And I have no doubts whatsoever that the US army will be ejected from a justifiably outraged Saudi Arabia by the end of the following week.

[Anton]

Congratulations Amaurote you succesfully dodged the question at hand. What you say may well happen, but do you agree with it?

For the record I also believe what Amaurote stated will happen.

[berly]

*PUH!* This kind of thing is irritating to me. This woman chose to enter the Air Force. The very career she chose dictates much of her life. I grew up in a military family. My father was a Lt. Col. If you don't think they tell you how to act here in America, then I've got news for you. They may not tell you whom to pray to, but they come close.

Anyway, I get off track. This woman has no reason to bring her right to chose a religion to a country that doesn't play that way. Saudi Arabia can run its country any way it wants. We may not like it or think it's the best thing to do, but TOUGH. We are visitors there, we should respect their choices and do our best not to upset their government.

If this woman has such a problem with this, why doesn't she move there and take on the Saudi traditions without the aid of a government base and/or freedom to chose.

Ugh. I've probably added absolutely no comprehensible or sound argument to this issue. I'm too annoyed to try.

And, in the "extended cat claw" portion of my post: Just look at her! She's doing herself a favor by being guaranteed a male escort and coverage from head to toe when she steps off the base.

[Amaurote]

Apologies, Anton; I'm incorrigible. Dodging a question is always safer than answering it, in my limited experience; particularly when the choices are equally invidious. In summary, I'm with you all the way on this one.

Embassies are treated legally as sovereign extensions of the individual nation concerned; hence, an attack on a US embassy is treated as an attack on the USA as a nation; they maintain jurisdiction and legal autonomy there. Military bases are usually established on a contractual basis, and invariably adopt a similar sort of quasi-autonomous policy. They're sovereign enclaves, in other words. I see no reason whatsoever why a US military court should erode - and affront - the sovereign rights of the Saudi Arabian people.

Let's follow the reductio ad absurdam argument:

I'm a pilot in the army of Nudatoria. My people are a liberal democratic folk, with a long history of avant-garde art, fiercely-prized freedoms, idiosyncracies and militant leftist political sympathies. One of our more exotic national traditions is the practice of stripping naked and parading down the street, burning national flags, praising Ho Chi Minh and shouting anti-Christian slogans. I am a proud Nudatorian, and I demand my right to follow these pursuits, wherever in the world I may be. It is my constitutional right under the Nudatorian Bill of Scandalously Libertarian Rights. I regard the USA as backward-looking because it does not look favourably upon these activities.

We have a Nudatorian base in Alabama. The Nudatorian High Command, realizing the deleterious effects this might have on US-Nudatorian diplomatic relations, have so far prevented me from doing what I, a proud female Nudatorian fighter pilot, regard as a god-given right. I am going to sue. I am also going to cause a diplomatic incident.

Nor am I logically correct. Nor are Martha McSally's views correct. From a military court's view, of course, one might argue logically that Martha McSally's case is justified, grant it, but demand in return that she and every other female officer foolish enough to risk their lives by spectacularly affronting Islamic Sha'ria should sign waivers legally exculpating the US military in the event of their untimely death at the hands of local Hamas/Islamic Jihad fanatics. I doubt they'd be trampled in the rush.

Her argument is also unsound; however appalling the idea of the abaya may be, it's also paralleled in Christian and Judaistic tradition - even now there are some Christians who believe in the Restoration of the Veil for women, on the grounds that the exposed faces of women are a temptation to the angels. This is absurd, of course; but it's enshrined in Saudia Arabian law.

McSally's case is egotistical, short-sighted, wrong; and, if successful, it will be politically and diplomatically catastrophic to US-Saudi relations.

[Redallnite]

I know that it is law in some areas in Saudi! I had too wear that hot crap when I was visiting friends for a weekend, in the compound you can wear anything you want but outside of the gates you go by the law. The United Arab Emirates on the other hand, you can wear just about anything as long as its below your knees...... She needs to get over it!!

[Diva]

I agree. As an American she has constitutional rights... in America. If I am to expect people from foreign countries to follow our laws then I should also be respectful of theirs while in a foreign country.

It is this kind of arrogance that has given America the reputation that we are just like her. The idea that it would even make it to the courts is what frustrates me.

[usantic]

I agree Diva, this pilots selfishness casts the majority of U.S. citizens in a bad light. This one will bite us in the ass and will only be avoided (in my opinion) if she gets reassigned to Alaska.