Does The Punishment Fit The Crime

[Diva]

Do you believe in time off for good behavior? Or should the time served be what the court decided? Should life mean life?

[Andie]

Lífe should mean life..
Good behavior??..Geezz..You ended up there for something that sure didnt include good bevavior..So the time the induvidiual is sentanced for is the time to spend in the hole..

Just because im nice, do everything right and work hard doesnt mean i can go home from work at lunch...

[Banger]

I agree with Andie on this one...If you have the guts enough to do some horrible act such as murder or rape, then you should serve as much time as the state can throw at you.

I mean some of these places have cable tv, 3 meals a day, exercise, libraries, and some, outdoor activities. Now these people want a break cuz they've been good for a couple of months.....*well lets see mister john doe, well it says here you killed someone* *yeah but I've been good for the last six months, don't you think i deserve a second chance* grrrr......

[Andie]

heh...one could look at it this way..when i did my tour i made $3 a day..(!).."Con's" makes about $20..
Isnt that a twisted world or what?

[Banger]

its a beautiful world we live in Andie.....

[love_tattoos]

I think when you're given a punishment, that punishment should be followed through. If you've committed a crime that justifies being sentanced to life in prison, then life in prison is what you should serve. I believe this more now with the way our society has turned. I think the criminals of our day and time are so far beyond turning their lives around. I would like to believe that if someone was actually granted parole, that they have changed and would try and go out there and make a difference.

[Redallnite]

Too many bleeding hearts!!!!:shutup:

[Sterling]

On the other hand, if there is no incentive for good behaviour or reform, then offenders are less likely to do so. The question to ask is: what purpose does incarceration serve society? There are basically three purposes:

1: To protect society by keeping violent or otherwise disruptive offenders locked up.

2: To act as a deterrent from committing a crime.

3: To reform offenders.

Retribution is not a valid reason to incarcerate someone, since it serves no useful purpose to society.

If an offender has shown himself to be reformed, and has served a significant proportion of their sentence, then what further societal good is served by keeping them locked up?

[Diva]

How exactly do they reform them? If someone is locked up without the temptation of repeating the crime, that does not prove that they are reformed. The problem is that the definition of reformed is so vague. Prove that that person is reformed from doing that particulare act, then I can see letting them go early.

[Sterling]

But of course there is plenty of temptation to commit crime inside jails. Violent offenders may be violent towards other prisoners, for example. An offender that has shown that they can control themselves surely deserves credit over someone who continues to be violent once jailed, no?

Parole boards are not arbitrary. They consider a prisoner's record while incarcerated, and will have the benefit of reports from psychological examiners and prison staff.

[usantic]

Wasn't the man that killed Polly Klasse out on parole?

[Jake]

Yes, usantic. While there is crime in jail, Sterling, I stand by Diva's statement. Unless you can prove that you have been reformed from that crime, you stay put until your time is served. The victims didn't get time off for good behavior, neither should the criminal.

[Sterling]

If there is no parole, then what incentive is there to behave yourself inside prison? Or to make any attempt at reform?

The comparison with victims is spurious and irrelevant.

[Banger]

Sterling what kind of criminal do you have in mind when you speak of incentive and reform? What about the career criminal that has been in and out of prison all his (or her) life? Or the kind of people that have given up on themselves and just don't care one way or the other what becomes of themselves. I understand your point of incentive...the guy who commits SEC fraud is gonna wanna get out of prison as soon as he can and will put in all the good time he can...but what about the guys that abuse that same incentive system just to commit futher crimes when released?

[Andie]

Do more crime in jail and get more time..If you behave and keep pit of trouble the release you when you time is up..thats should be good enough..

And take some of their fancy stuff away..I see people daily who would have a higher standard of life if the killed someone and went to jail..Give it to those people who suffer AND stay out of trouble..

[Diva]

If a criminal knows that he'll get out sooner with good behavior then the time isn't that bad to them. 25 years is 25 years, period. You tell them they can get off in 8, then the crime is worth the time.

[Andie]

Prisons should be so terrifying that a criminal-to-be would be scared away from commiting a crime..wonder where we went wrong...

[Sterling]

Studies show that you are wrong. Reoffending rates are strongly linked to the quality of reform programs inside jails, and part of that is the incentive based on the possibility of parole.

In general, it seems that there are two competing philosophies of imprisonment. The American (and to some extent British) model, where the goal is retribution and giving criminals their 'just desserts', and the European model where the goal is rehabilitation and the protection of society. Countries tending towards the latter model have lower crime rates and lower reoffending rates.

[Banger]

You are probably right. What kind of crimes were taken into consideration in this (these) studies?

[Sterling]

IIRC they mainly focussed on things like burglary, muggings, etc.

[Banger]

These are crimes that don't carry stiff penalty. I wonder what a report based on murder and rape would look like. Is there one, and are the findings similar? (I'm not being an asshole...I'm actually very curious)

[Sterling]

Not sure. Murder and rape are also much rarer, of course. Some murderers and rapist have underlying psychological issues which are basically intractable, and in those cases, permanent incarceration, perhaps in secure mental health facilities, would be appropriate.

[Jake]

I understand your point, Sterling. Out here there is a big problem with drunken drivers. The penalty is manslauter. The amount of repeat offenders is rediculous. A drunk will swear on his mama's bible that he's quit and then go out for beers afterwards. They're sober out of necessity, not because they wanted to quit. Same goes with drug addicts. The time they spend in jail is the time we are safe from them. I cannot see turning them loose early for not drinking.

[Banger]

Originally posted by Andie
Prisons should be so terrifying that a criminal-to-be would be scared away from commiting a crime..wonder where we went wrong...

You know Andie...the more i read this post the more i agree with it.....

[Andie]

Dont get me wrong..Im all for treatment..The problems is that most criminals dont want it..
And treating a person who's only interest is to get out earlier is as effective as trying to train a dog to be a cat..

[Princess]

IF I let my kids out of time out early or off grounding early, they re-commit the SAME offence 70% of the time.... and the next time they get sentanced, all I hear is "IM good let me out "

IF I make them serve their entire sentance.... the repeat offense rate is lowered to 10% ..... and only when the circumstances are extreme.... and when they serve their sentance for that..... not a word or whine because they know they deserved their punishment.


apply that to state prisions and maybe we would see an improvement...


of course, at home here time out doens't mean cable tv and weights to lift..... it is really hard time compared to prison.... good thing my kids don't know THAT yet. ;)

[Diva]

Princess, I couldn't have said it better myself. The goal of the prisoner should be to prove that they have learned their lesson after they serve their full sentence.